Norinco Type 56 Serial Numbers
The dating methodology mentioned in this thread is still very much applicable for /26 Type 56 1/2 rifles though. See my post on the SKS files and I also mentioned it on this forum but can't locate the thread. 1965 Type 56 Assault Rifle with 11M Serial Number. Just wondering what a Norinco SKS is worth with all matching serial numbers including the stock. Everything is in what appears to be unused/unfired condition. Only thing missing is the mag (owner is currently looking for it). Everything else is there and has matching serial numbers. Can post pics if that would help. Thanks in advance.
Edit:.Announcement by martin08.The thread is opening back up as a Sticky - with simple terms in bold below:The material contained within this thread has value to the SKS collecting community. It does not come without controversy.
The Chinese government and/or arsenal facilities have released little to no manufacturing data regarding total production, serial number lots, factory code meanings, design change implementations, clandestine or commercial pursuits. Therefore WE, as ardent collectors and historians, must responsibly collect our own data, offer our own analysis, discuss theories, provide verifiable photographic/written documentation, and draw sensible conclusions of our own in regard to the Type-56 variants.Without a massive document dump by the Chinese, the collecting community must painstakingly trudge forth, using the best tools which are available to us. This isn't a perfect science, but it's all we have. So, let's not either accept every aspect as gospel, nor dismiss the content in its entirety. Instead, let's continue with with responsible and respectful discussion.I could have edited or deleted posts in this thread, but I have allowed them all to stand for now. Not that I believe that flaming, baiting or name calling should be condoned on Gunboards, but that I understand that some members have dedicated large portions of their time and resources on the subject matter, and therefore have a personal stake in the content and eventual outcome in the study of the Chinese SKS.In reopening this thread, I fully expect that there will be continued differences of opinions. As it stands, the subject matter up to this point has merit.
But moving forward, if there is any more disrespectful posting, it will need to be locked again for good.So, for those with skin in the game, it's up to you to police yourselves. You can keep the thread open with respectful discourse, or shut it down with vindictive banter. Your choice, and I'll reluctantly have to be the judge. My preference is for the former, and the readers may continue to benefit from the research and hard work of dedicated SKS enthusiasts.Thanks in advance - Matt MartinLast edited by martin08; at 11:19 AM. I think its very nice that you took the time to give credit for the above symbols as coming from the sks files.
While some of the above did come from their research almost all of the triangle, oval, rectangle, diamond, and many of the letter codes came from my research. Lots of good research has been donated to this forum by me and many others this is the forum most all info started and was used by others on other boards. The point i make in mt post here is while allot of work has been done by me and many others we still cannot verify it. I hope people keep an open mind in their search for answers. Its been a good thing that many of the Albanian guns got back here to be seen. It would appear that China dumped its early non standard guns on Albania as aid to get their inventory standardized.
Keep on working on solutions to the puzzle but I wouldn't take credit for something I did not do. The Series analysis above confirms my thesis that Initially, in PRC, all Small Arms Factories, whether Independent Factories, or Annexes in other 'Light Industries' Factories, were coded with a final '6' in their ID. That later Degenerated into the Multiple Derivatives with other 'end Digits', maybe because they were not 'Small arms' Plants, or because the Chinese had realised that Western Mil-Int.
Had decoded their Factory Number system. ( similarly, end digit '1' denotes SA Ammunition, and Digit '4' denotes clothing or webbing factories )Markings such as 'SKS D, SKSS, and KS-30' denote certain design variations with 30 round AK magazines (we in Australia denote them all as 'SKK' denoting Kalashnikov magazine.) M21 denote various export models, etc. As Mil-Aid.Very thorough and informative Post.Doc AV. Here is a photo clearly showing a break in the first digit making it a 9. As I said in my previous post you have to have a good stamping when something like this first digit can be either a 8 or 9 or in the case of the triangles that have a 6 or 5 sometimes its hard to tell. Many of the real stylize ones are very hard to read.
Also some photos sometimes distort the numbers. I posted the first groups of factory codes many years ago and did not claim any right to them they have been copied for years by everyone. The ones in this post are clearly marked as property of sks guide.
Some of the older members of this board have access to my serial number lists and factory code lists for their research. I think its very nice that you took the time to give credit for the above symbols as coming from the sks files.
While some of the above did come from their research almost all of the triangle, oval, rectangle, diamond, and many of the letter codes came from my research. Lots of good research has been donated to this forum by me and many others this is the forum most all info started and was used by others on other boards. The point i make in mt post here is while allot of work has been done by me and many others we still cannot verify it. I hope people keep an open mind in their search for answers. Its been a good thing that many of the Albanian guns got back here to be seen.
It would appear that China dumped its early non standard guns on Albania as aid to get their inventory standardized. Keep on working on solutions to the puzzle but I wouldn't take credit for something I did not do.Good advice Howie, I am sure there is alot of reinventing the wheel (so to say) going on but hopefully as you say, people should keep an open mind to all this. I think you deserve alot of credit for pioneering the study of all this.Last edited by mriddick; at 10:30 AM. Good advice Howie, I am sure there is alot of reinventing the wheel (so to say) going on but hopefully as you say, people should keep an open mind to all this. I think you deserve alot of credit for pioneering the study of all this.I also agree with this statement. Thanks HowieAfter I originally posted this I started thinking how hard it must have been for Howie (and others) back in the day to find the original information on these arsenal stamps.
Back when you couldn't borrow someone's work but had to do it yourself. Did it for the good of the community of collectors, for the hunt. Oh the good old days. Thanks again Howie.And thank you mriddick for your comment.GaryLast edited by macgaryver; at 12:29 PM. I'm new to SKS collecting and am learning much from all of the available sites and contributors. I appreciate the time and effort everyone has put into the task of making the identification of unique features of each country's rendering of the SKS available to the public.I also feel it is unnecessary to continue to bite the hands that feed us. ABC people compiled this group of data and XYZ people compiled another group, while PQR people were able to trim the fat and combine both groups into one.what is the difference??
The important issue is the fact that these data are available to and can be easily accessed by everyone. This can only lead to the improvement of our own understanding of this weapon (and others) and the resulting increase in its intrinsic value as the supplies continue to dry up.It's a win-win for us all.now stop bickering and get back to debating, boys!!Gail. A revitalized interest in the Chinese SKS came into play with the Albanian Imports of five years ago. Along with the interest, a flood original condition guns allowed new data to become available for study.
With this data, some long standing theories came into question, and new theories were presented.The enthusiasm surrounding the study of Early Chinese guns was also applied to several other areas of SKS interest, and thus, more verifiable data has been presented on nearly every model of the carbine.Not all information is new. Credit must be given to the pioneers in the study of the SKS. Without their effort, we might not even have a forum on which to post.The folks at SKS-Files have presented their findings on their site. And instead of continually linking back to their site, they have opted to post some information here for review.I ask that we give them respect and some latitude. I ask also, that they have patience with our membership, and reciprocate respect.Thank you.Stepping off soapbox. Howie's chart has been in our book 'The SKS Carbine' for many years. I have been to China numerous times and have tried to put a factory location to a triangle with limited success (as you can see).
I started going over in the mid 90s and many of the factories were long gone or, in the case of the large factories that were producing for export, the old employees that had any knowledge were retired. There was also a reluctance to give out 'state secrets' by many.
1956 Norinco Sks
There is no way in hell that you will get a Chinese factory to turn over their list of serial numbers. The only way would be to set up a data base for each factory and ask people to send in info. Even then.it would be a guess.As to the Chinese guns from Albania, I handled every one of them and all those imported by Century were produced by factory 26.I estimate that Factory 26 produced at least 60% of all SKS carbines. It is still in production (AK carbines and motorcycles). I have always collected by factory code and variation. Its a daunting and can be expensive task. I always have said its much like the German 98K in collecting Lots of codes and variations.
Yugo Sks Serial Numbers
I am sure I am not the only factory code collector you just do not hear about them. There are quite a few scarce sks carbines to get.Whew.that would be a ton of SKSs or 98Ks. Since I'm approaching my 'golden years' (yeah right.) I'm going to be lucky to find a good representative from each of the manufacturing countries before I begin pushing up daises-let alone one from each arsenal.